Missing Barn Boats

[Olaf Bleck]

... but as indicated by Peter the value/price point is determined by what a buyer is willing to pay not necessarily the asking price.  The fact is a new boat is pretty affordable by today's standards.

It's also determined by what people are willing to sell their boats for, while hopefully not selling out.

[Peter Beardsley]

I can put the comps out there for recent sales for anyone who wants to see them.  Some of them I think were pretty good boats and the owners who were motivated to sell were able to sell them quickly.  Not everyone will be happy with what they see, but it will add a big layer of transparency for those who are interested.  Boats that are priced at or around what the market (i.e. BUYERS, not existing owners) think is fair sell quickly.  Boats that are priced too high stay on the forums for a year plus, which is bad for everyone. 

[Olaf Bleck]

Boats that are priced at or around what the market (i.e. BUYERS, not existing owners) think is fair sell quickly.  Boats that are priced too high stay on the forums for a year plus, which is bad for everyone.

The market is determined by supply and demand.  If there's an abundance of boats for sale, the price tends to drop.  If there's a seller who doesn't really care what he gets for whatever reason or will take a loss to move it faster, then he can of course sell it rather quickly.  If there's a fixer-upper that someone wants to move and the buyer has boat building skills, then the buyer discounts the work it needs (and hence the effective price) and it will move quickly.

If there's pressure from other sources (such as the Class....?!!) on sellers to sell boats at a discount, then NO, not everyone wins: the seller looses his equity, and the future sellers lose too based on the comps.  I'd be appalled if the Class was in some way encouraging this sort of price manipulation.

[Darren Gilbert]

+1

The market is determined by supply and demand.  If there's an abundance of boats for sale, the price tends to drop.  If there's a seller who doesn't really care what he gets for whatever reason or will take a loss to move it faster, then he can of course sell it rather quickly.  If there's a fixer-upper that someone wants to move and the buyer has boat building skills, then the buyer discounts the work it needs (and hence the effective price) and it will move quickly.

If there's pressure from other sources (such as the Class....?!!) on sellers to sell boats at a discount, then NO, not everyone wins: the seller looses his equity, and the future sellers loose too based on the comps.  I'd be appalled if the Class was in some way encouraging this sort of price manipulation.

[John Leyland]

To help those selling Bennett built boats I might suggest that they add that the fact they were built in the US.  This might help with potential Canadian buyers who have to pay 9.5% duty on UK built boats while US built boats are covered under NAFTA.

[Dan Tucker]

I agree with Peter, the worst thing for the Class is not low price boats selling quickly, but overpriced used boats languishing on the for sale listing for months or years upon end.

If you have a one-design boat for sale, and others are selling when yours isn't, you might think to adjust your listed price.

[Darren Gilbert]

It's a shame that this topic continues to be so hot on the forums.  The Viper is such a fantastic boat, the owners are a friendly group of people and fun to sail with/against, and the class has done a very good job growing the fleet over the last number of years.  Rondar continues to produce boats to meet demand, and there is a healthy number of used boats for sale over a wide range of price points.  There is also a healthy range of boats as far as condition (everything from turn key to fixer upper, and everything in between).

We just concluded a tightly contested North American Championship, and HPDO is right around the corner.  Next year at NA's, my personal opinion is that it will be the largest collection of Vipers on one start line ever.  October 2015 will probably be the best month of Viper racing in the history of the class.

Let's agree to disagree, move on from this, and get back to fun Viper sailing forums again.

[Justin Scott]

I have just ordered a new boat. It will be my fifth Viper (jest trying to keep up with Jonesy).

I have sold three previous Vipers and I will be selling my current boat.
The sale will take place at a price it is worth to me and a price it is worth to the buyer. Nobody else can affect that.

The buyers of my three previous boats, Doug, Joe and Hiro are loving their boats. If you ask them I bet they will tell you they were happy with the price they paid and I was very happy with the price I received.

I gained three friends in the process and get to sail against them.

What more can you want?

[RobThompson]

This thread last touched 8 years ago...

Where is the hull number on the boat?

I just bought a mk1 (I think, based on the descriptions) here in New Zealand - named Growler, by the state of the signwriting Id guess it's the original name.

It needs some love, but it's sound.

[Darren Gilbert]

This thread last touched 8 years ago...

Where is the hull number on the boat?

I just bought a mk1 (I think, based on the descriptions) here in New Zealand - named Growler, by the state of the signwriting Id guess it's the original name.

It needs some love, but it's sound.

Hi Rob - Congratulations on the purchase.  Hull numbers are located within the Vin Number, likely indicated on the transom.  If you share your Vin someone can decode it to tell you your hull number.  Alternatively, can you share you sail number?  Most boats have the hull number match the sail number.

[Justin S]

This thread last touched 8 years ago...

Where is the hull number on the boat?

I just bought a mk1 (I think, based on the descriptions) here in New Zealand - named Growler, by the state of the signwriting Id guess it's the original name.

It needs some love, but it's sound.

I am familiar with Growler and corresponded with one of the prior owners. 
I can look up the number for you this weekend and I think I might have some photos from the past.

At one time it had a humongous, outa control, very tall custom carbon rig.  If that has survived, I would be shocked. When I asked them what it took to sail with that rig, the response was " You need to be a strong swimmer!"

[RobThompson]

Cool! yeah some pics would be awesome!

The only number I can find on it is a faint outline on the hull at the bow - ~150mm high font: 20

I suspect its the same rig you mention, maybe cut down a bit- masthead to gooseneck is 8m.
It's carbon but it has obvious modifications along the way and painted black. Mast section is pretty hefty, suggests it came from a bigger much heavier boat.

It still has the original 70kg bulb (I think), but also came with a spare 130kg bulb. Its fair, but never fitted with holes / bolts etc - I'm guessing that was a response to the bigger rig but they cut down the rig instead of fitting it -seems like a wise idea!

It's in sailing condition. But it's an old boat and it shows re paint patch-ups, deck gear modifications and additions/subtractions etc. A few cracks and dents etc, most of the running gear looks a bit old and weathered.

There's cracking around the aft end of the keel cassette at cockpit sole level - doesnt look terminal... Also some gelcoat cracking around the rudder post.

There's separation in the laminate around sections of the the gunn'l join (at the edges). But it seems to be between the gelcoat/first layer of glass and main laminate, again not a structural problem imho. Its not in the join itself, nor in the guts of the laminate.
 
My plan is to give it a big ol' clean, replace whatever running gear looks dodgy, and go sailing for the coming summer. Then give it some love over next winter - nice wee project for this old desk-bound boatbuilder :)


 

[Justin S]

My images of Growler are on a previous computer.  They might be there somewhere but is a long time since it got turned on.

My memory is fading. I think she got to New Zealand because Brian sold her to an AC team member who threw her in a container with gear and got her to NZ for free.  Once there she was acquired by a group of adrenaline junkies who fitted the absurd rig, went screaming around but did a whole lot of swimming. The beast was then tamed by shortening the rig and went to a really nice guy who I spoke to a few times. He raced her in the harbor on handicap. He owned a cruising cat and eventually sold Growler to spend time cruising KZ and the Pacific. My cousin and her family spent a couple of years in Auckland to see if they would like to live there and I introduced them to the former Growler owner , who took them cruising in the cat.....they became friends.

The Viper tribe is global and very friendly.   

[Justin S]

If anyone is looking for Barn boats to extend TLC to....I have found two nice Mark 1 barn boats.

I say "nice" because they are both Joe DaPonte builds (means a better quality assembly and better keel boxes), and both have carbon rigs and the keel job done.   Carbon masts have become the big investment for barn builds, so it is important that they already have the masts. Neither of them have been used for 10 years. 

Neither of them has the vertical bracket installed.

Please contact me if you are interested or if you know a budget conscious program that would be interested. 

I remain curious what happened to Mark 2 boat #147 which has disappeared into a barn somewhere.

[RobThompson]

Thanks Justin! - good info to know

As happens, I was gazumped by other things and havent even got in the water yet!

But I have finally got it to the marina and mast up (treetrunk of a mast, not exactly bendy/skiff like). Now to sort out all the deck gear...

I have some questions but I'll put in a new post