Re: Vintage boats

Garrett Johns · January 27, 2011, 10:17:38 PM

I don't want to turn this into a forum but....I am wanting a used boat and have lots of questions..
So a "heavy" early Rondar boat or a Bennett boat that has had all the upgrade done.. what are the plus and minus.
If I show up with either one on the race course and everything else is relativly equal..sails, sailing skills, etc, will I get eaten alive by the newer boats? Just trying to clarify my options and decide how much money I want to spend (meaning how long I want to be in the dog house!)
Appreciate the help!

Greg Jackson · January 27, 2011, 10:41:26 PM

Garrett,

All the boats are pretty much equal.

Here in AZ I won our series two years ago with my #46.

Last year #72 won. This year?

Back East early boats and new boats are always mixed in the top five...

Greg
USA 46
heroin

Dave Nickerson · January 28, 2011, 08:36:46 AM

+1 My experience on the race course is that all vintages of Vipers (if well cared for and with good sails) go the same speed. The difference is the team sailing the boat.

Drew Harper · January 28, 2011, 10:46:56 AM

Garrett,

Here's the Generations

Mark 1 - Commonly reffered to as Bennett Boats. Up to #69? (I want that one =p) I don't know if they ever produced Hulls 1-9.
Mark 2 - Rondar built on Bennett Tooling. Hulls #70-101. I believe the first 6 or 7 were overbuilt/heavy. Heard all sorts of reasons why. Bottom line comes to the team. #71 (a heavy) has won LOTS of races at the hands of Tony Chapman in AZ in all sorts of breeze, particularly in the light stuff (Tony's forte). #71 won the SA ISAF 2009.
Mark 3 - Rondar built on all new tooling. #102 through current (I think we are at #166)

It's pretty clear that in the Viper class, nearly anyone can win a race if you go the setup the rig/boat right, go the right way, turn at the right time, pick the correct gate, and don't f'up the sail handling.

Bottom line on buying a boat is how much time do you want to translate from on-water (sailing/racing) to in the shop (restoration/repair).

Justin Scott · January 29, 2011, 12:15:43 PM

It was a handful of the Mark IIs that were more weight.

I beleive that the first mark II, #70, is as light as any. It is certainly annoyingly fast at times.

Matt Rowlinson · January 31, 2011, 10:41:03 AM

Quote from: Justin Scott on January 29, 2011, 12:15:43 PM
It was a handful of the Mark IIs that were more weight.

I beleive that the first mark II, #70, is as light as any. It is certainly annoyingly fast at times.

mnn hm. We should weigh Grendel sometime--but light air has never been our problem.

Olaf Bleck · February 01, 2011, 12:13:54 AM

Quote from: Matt Rowlinson on January 31, 2011, 10:41:03 AM

mnn hm. We should weigh Grendel sometime--but light air has never been our problem.

It'd be great to get some scales at some of the larger events this year, just to see. I'm real curious. Either a load cell on a hoist, or truck scales (drive trailer with boat on, weigh, remove boat, weigh again).

Olaf Bleck · February 01, 2011, 12:16:12 AM

By the way, #24 is sold. :-)

She's gonna be upgraded to modern standards out there and generally available for charter.

Jeff Jones · February 01, 2011, 12:18:39 AM

Quote from: Olaf Bleck on February 01, 2011, 12:13:54 AM
Quote from: Matt Rowlinson on January 31, 2011, 10:41:03 AM

mnn hm. We should weigh Grendel sometime--but light air has never been our problem.

It'd be great to get some scales at some of the larger events this year, just to see. I'm real curious. Either a load cell on a hoist, or truck scales (drive trailer with boat on, weigh, remove boat, weigh again).

I have a very Nice hanging load cell scale vie used to check a few boats. Id be happy to bring it to mgrw or crw.

Jay Harrell · February 01, 2011, 07:44:30 AM

Quote from: Olaf Bleck on February 01, 2011, 12:13:54 AM
Either a load cell on a hoist, or truck scales (drive trailer with boat on, weigh, remove boat, weigh again).

It's my understanding that the drive-on truck scales aren't really sensitive enough for small-boat weighing purposes. To get +/- a pound or two, you need that load cell.

Olaf Bleck · February 01, 2011, 08:19:05 AM

Quote from: Jay Harrell on February 01, 2011, 07:44:30 AM

It's my understanding that the drive-on truck scales aren't really sensitive enough for small-boat weighing purposes. To get +/- a pound or two, you need that load cell.

Heh, I'd be interested in +- 20 at this point! I put #56 on the hoist with a 600# full scale spring rotary balance and it wound up to about 850+....

Jeff, yeah, bring that puppy! It'd be great to get some data. I'll bet you could even charge admission, like say a six-pack or some rum.

Jay Harrell · February 01, 2011, 08:22:55 AM

Quote from: Jeff Jones on February 01, 2011, 12:18:39 AM
I have a very Nice hanging load cell scale vie used to check a few boats. Id be happy to bring it to mgrw or crw.

Bring it! Sounds like a great Ash Wednesday project...

Drew Harper · February 01, 2011, 10:56:09 AM

WOW...congrats Olaf !!

Anything I can do to help, let me know.

There's two great spots that repair boats in the area. Berkeley Marine Center, Cree Partridge who also builds lots of one-offs for Antrim and others.

Elkhorn Composites in Santa Cruz area. They built the first 3 U24's, do all the U20 fixes and are great guys.

Be great to have you in the area. We have a GREAT WCC this year.

Paul Zimmerman · February 01, 2011, 11:20:34 AM

OLaf did the bulb conversion on #56 at Miami last year. One all nighter with beer and some drunken Viper sailors. He is quite capable.

Matt Rowlinson · February 01, 2011, 11:11:12 PM

Quote from: Jay Harrell on February 01, 2011, 08:22:55 AM
Quote from: Jeff Jones on February 01, 2011, 12:18:39 AM
I have a very Nice hanging load cell scale vie used to check a few boats. Id be happy to bring it to mgrw or crw.

Bring it! Sounds like a great Ash Wednesday project...

Bet lots of class members would buy you & your crew a round for use of this. Unfortunately, most at CRW ramp launch--no crane at the resort. Maybe the NA's in Sarnia?